Currently

A few years ago I started writing about Belinda’s medical journey when I realized that people didn’t really know what we were struggling with. It helped a lot to have friends and family understand how it was a serious issue and not just a passing thing.

This morning I feel compelled to do that again, on a separate issue.

Ben has been without work for just over a year now. I was able to get by, struggling along with the surety that he would find work in his field again soon. We are still struggling by, but now our credit cards are maxed, our credit score has crashed, and I’m not sure what I’m going to cut.

The situation.

Ben is a computer scientist. A mainframe developer. He’s trained in legacy systems like COBOL (the language financial systems run on) and also has experience moving systems off of the mainframe to newer languages (although he personally thinks that COBOL is superior). He is also neurodivergent in some way. We don’t know exactly what, and he doesn’t want to be tested and categorized. I get that. But his neurodivergence is making it apparently impossible for him to find work in his field any more. He spent 28 years with the same company, only to have them push him out after the transition to the new system. Now he gets interviews, but doesn’t do well and doesn’t get the job. Again and again, and it’s crushing him. I believe it’s the neurodivergence, but I don’t know how to help. I tried to spruce up his linkedin, but that didn’t go great either. He is SO SKILLED and would be an incredible, faithful asset to any company, but he isn’t “normal” enough to ace these interviews. So that’s a problem.

Why doesn’t he go get a regular job in the meantime? Well, he has to have a job with benefits, or else some kind of contract labor that would pay enough to get health insurance on our own. He’s applied for contract labor programming jobs but so far, no luck on those either. Any new job needs to include comparable health insurance or pay enough for us to lawfully maintain the coverage Belinda’s care requires. Until then, we are following program rules to keep her treatment continuous. We have looked at jobs outside of mainframe that have benefits, but he doesn’t get those either. He has even applied for jobs that, after paying for gas and the employee insurance, would still come out negative once we account for total costs of care. But he still tried for them and didn’t get them.

I have also applied for a few jobs, although I don’t know how that would work. I am my mom’s primary caretaker. Sarah is also here and I drive her to school and pick her up most days, and then I take her to her doctor’s appointments and therapy and tutoring and things after that. She is still playing catch-up on a lot of things and will be for a long time to come. I also still take care of Belinda’s medical, even though she is 18. It’s just too much for her. So I take her to appointments on school breaks or attend three-way virtual appointments with her. She has another procedure in DC in December and I’ll be accompanying her on that.

Belinda is high functioning autistic. Seems to be something that runs in our family because she, Bennett, and Lenora were all diagnosed. And then me. I had no idea, and since I homeschooled them all, it wasn’t on anyone’s radar. Sarah had been diagnosed in elementary school. I thought that probably Bennett had adhd, and when he started vo-tech and was having trouble we got him tested. Lenora was also having trouble in college. And when they were both diagnosed with adhd, Belinda was tested. And at some point all three of them were diagnosed with autism, and I finally realized autism isn’t always Rain Man and that I had it too. It took extra tests to get mine identified. The psychiatrist said that I have a very high IQ (like…he said it several times) and that was how I had gotten away with my masking for such a long time. One thing that I see now that shows I am truly autistic – when the psychiatrist said that I was in the top 97th percentile of the population, I nodded but wasn’t really interested since that’s exactly how I used to score in the old California Achievement Tests they gave us in elementary school. And then he stopped, and explained how that is actually a VERY BIG DEAL and then I realized he wanted me to be more impressed with that information and so I acted like that was very interesting so he would be satisfied and we come move on to the rest of the results. It worked, we moved on, and looking back, I was still just masking. And I do this all of the time.

Anyway. I write for the newspaper and get paid by the story, and that hasn’t bumped us over the financial limit yet. Our only other income is the oil/gas royalty that I get from my portion of our family farm. It’s not a huge amount but it has been able to keep us afloat, albeit at the poverty line. It goes up and down. A few months ago it dropped enough that we were able to qualify for government food assistance. We received that for two months until the shutdown. Ben and I also visit food pantries each week. I have two I usually go to, and he does one for me on Wednesday nights so I can take Mom and Sarah to church. (Although I haven’t been getting them to church at all lately…it’s gotten to be so much to have to take two people who are difficult to get there. I miss it.

We were pretty broke when Ben lost his job. Lenora had gotten married that summer, and we had spent money getting our bathroom redone (our house is super old and there was actually a hole in the floor, so it was definitely time to do it). We’d also spent money on Lenora’s last semesters in college. A lot of money went towards Belinda’s diagnosis of achalasia, and the battle we went through to get that figured out. Then came the additional diagnoses of Ehlers-Danlos, MCAS, and POTS, and all the different appointments and things we had to go to for that and to get on top of those diseases. So we went into the joblesness with pretty much nothing. Some people in our church and some friends helped us raise the 3000 we had to have to continue COBRA insurance for Belinda’s second surgery, which was Nov. 5, 2024 (Ben lost his job on Oct. 31 and health insurance stopped right then; thanks for that, former employer of 28 years).

So now? I go to food pantries. I have the EBT card, which will maybe start up again. I keep finding new ways to keep things going. Belinda has gotten grants from the National Organization for Rare Diseases, which is how we are able to pay for hotel and ground transportation in DC. A charity called Mercy Medical Angels has gotten us flights twice for the DC trips (once in last November and once next month). Soonercare (Medicaid) has approved Belinda’s out of state procedure and may be able to help with some other expenses while we are there. I’m still looking into that. I found that the insurance carrier we have with Soonercare, Humana Healthy Horizons, offers some value added benefits, and one was a once-a-year assistance with utility bills. So I was able to get that for all three of us, and that helped us keep the electricity on and the propane in the tank. I also was able to get emergency medical utility assistance with the state through the Liheap program, because we have life-saving medications that require refrigeration. That’s once a year, but thankfully it started over in October so I was able to get it in September and I am currently trying to get it approved for November. We follow every program’s rules, report changes, and keep documentation for anything we use.

Mom is considered her own household. She has her own separate suite and entrance and pays her own expenses. Sarah is counted with her dad for benefits purposes, but the school here knows her situation and helps with what they can — she gets free breakfast and lunch and sometimes take-home food boxes, and they’ve reached out about holiday needs too. I’m thankful.

All of this stuff is very difficult to do. The help is there but it is hard to get it. I don’t know how poor people do this all of the time. This year has been so stressful. Every time I need to talk to someone about SNAP or Soonercare or Liheap I have to call and be on hold for hours. The people are lovely when I finally get through but it’s rough that they can’t have chat or email or something. But that’s not how it works. There’s so much to research – like the rare diseases organization or the medical flights. No one helps you find these things. It’s sink or swim. The people at the food pantries are also so lovely but I am definitely experiencing fatigue of this whole thing. I thought this was going to be temporary but now I don’t know what to think.

Belinda’s internist has written a letter stating that she should be considered disabled because of her many issues. I keep going back and forth on whether I want to apply for that with the government. There are a lot of benefits and I can’t really find many negatives, so maybe it’s just the thought of it that I’m having trouble with. But I also know that if I had known that I had the same issues as her (minus the achalasia) when I was younger, I would have wanted to have applied for it. I still would have wanted to work as much as I could, but I would have understood that when it all got to be too much for me all those years ago, it wasn’t that I was bad or lazy, it was autistic burnout. I know I said above that I have tried for a few jobs, but even when I do I wonder how I think I’ll be able to continue functioning when I feel like I am doing all that I can to make it through every day, without an outside the home job. I don’t have enough recent work credits to apply for disability myself, though there are other programs with different rules. Belinda’s doctor has written a letter supporting her case, and we’re praying through what the next step should be for her. But of course, I didn’t know I had any real problems back then, and instead I blamed myself for not being able to cope with both job and home life. But still I waver what’s the best thing to do for Belinda.

I do have a lot of issues too. I have had terrible hip pain for years, but Belinda’s diagnosis of ehlers-danlos made me think that was the answer to the riddle no one could solve. So now I know that in addition to autism and adhd, I have ehlers-danlos, pots, and mcas. I also have psoriatic arthritis apparently, I just had both things which is why the medication didn’t do much for me. At least now I know why I can’t sit in one position for more than a few minutes. It doesn’t have a solution but knowing makes it more tolerable.

What else? Well, back when we were middle class, we had the house rewired so we could have central heat and air for Mom. We got so far as getting the entire mother-in-law suite set up, and we got the system upstairs, but downstairs is still a window unit and propane heaters. Mom is downstairs now and it’s driving me crazy listening to her talk about how she is hot or cold and asking what she should do about it. And it’s going to get very cold this winter because there are still many holes in the walls of this house and when the north wind blows hard in the winter there’s a breeze and you can see your breath in the kitchen. I also looked into assistance with home repair but the questions made the whole Sarah and Mom situation difficult to explain, plus Ben R and Lenora in the mother-in-law suite, and so I gave up on that. I’ll just try to tape towels over the cracks where they’ve come loose again.

The house is such a mess. When Lenora and Ben R moved into the separate suite and Mom came to the downstairs area she has, most of her stuff came inside and we haven’t yet found a place for it. We don’t really have any storage space here, and I haven’t felt up to going through all of it. We also have quite a bit of food pantry food that is starting to take over. Mostly in the form of boxes of macaroni and cheese and peanut butter. We appreciate it and are keeping it for the future, but it’s hard to keep up with some of the items. Ben and I also have so much stuff everywhere. Too much clothing, too much furniture, too much medical stuff, too much paperwork, too much stuff. Hard to let go of anything when you don’t have money to replace things though. My latest plan is to try to fit all the downstairs clutter upstairs and then not let any visitors go up there, even for the bathroom!

Our credit is maxed everywhere. We stayed away from credit cards for as long as we could but finally we had to use them starting in the summer. Our electric has a cut off date on it (I should be able to take care of about half of that with state assistance but I don’t know where the other $800 is going to come from – the holes in the walls contributes to this). We owe the propane company over a thousand dollars. I would estimate that we probably are about 15,000 in debt at the moment. I pay the minimums and the late charges, and I add $50 or so to each one but it’s like a drop in the bucket. The credit cards were basically my last ace in the hole. Now that they are full I’m not sure how we will keep our heads above water. But I guess it has worked so far. Our home is paid for. I am thankful for that. Taxes and insurance are hitting hard but we have been able to make those payments at least.

In other good news, Sarah’s birth certificate is in the mail and when we get that we can finally get her drivers’ permit. That has been a huge undertaking and took five months to get done, and only happened because a suggestion from one of Sarah’s teachers that blossomed into an actual solution.

More good news – we are all alive and reasonably healthy. Belinda is doing well in school and is finally making some friends (hard for autistics) and is working to start a Pre-Law club. She is having difficulty with one class, biology, but she is working hard to keep her 4.0 average.

Belinda and I got her FAFSA filled out and even though it will show that we have too much income for a pell grant since it is based on 2024 income, I know that her school will be able to adjust that based on our current situation, like they did last year. Otherwise I don’t know if she would be able to go to school without huge student loan debt.

Our cars keep running. Belinda’s had an issue but Ben was able to fix it himself. He always impresses me with that sort of thing! He truly can do anything he sets his mind to. God willing, Sarah will be the fourth young person in this family to learn to drive in my van.

Our appliances all keep chugging along. Our washer and dryer, refrigerator, dishwasher, well pump, microwave – all these things keep going. A burner has gone out on the stove and there is a disturbing spot in the microwave where whatever coats the inside of the microwave has worn through and now it’s a big rusty spot, but it’s still working so far! We still can afford laundry detergent and dishwasher soap and toothpaste and other things that food pantries don’t provide. That’s good!

I decadently bought Chinese food for Bennett and I yesterday for lunch, and I have leftovers for today and tomorrow! This makes me very, very happy and I will probably watch a true crime documentary while I eat it, before I get back to actual work. My to-do list is always disappointingly long.

I have found a supplement that seems to be helping with my brain fog! I’ve had long covid since 2020, and the brain fog has been horrible. I still have a little of it, but it’s so much better. The theory is that the fog is caused by inflammation in the brain, and this supplement helps with inflammation. My hips are also hurting less, and the orthopedic surgeon I went to last month said that the supplement also helps with arthritis pain and other inflammation issues. Hooray! I must be able to taste and smell a little more too, because I now smell it when Nutmeg has an accident. Poor old kitty but I’m glad I can smell it and fix it!

I’m starting to feel optimistic about my writing again. I’ve been reading a ton (thankful for libraries) but I think the supplement is also slowly opening me up to the possibility of creating stories again.

Lenora and Ben R, and Bennett and Mia are happy and thriving in their marriages. The last two nights I have dreamed that my old “Garvie Fam 5” was together and the first night we were in an escape room that was a whole house, and last night I dreamed that we were at a tourist town and we were in a treasure hunt. I love Ben R and Mia and I’m so glad they are in our family, and I love Mom and Sarah, but I do miss the old family days. My eyes are tearing up as I write this. It has been hard letting go of all three of them in the same year. Everything has changed so much. It’s been so hard. But I have to keep fighting the good fight.

I need prayers. I need prayers badly. Please pray:

–For patience for me. With Mom, with Sarah, with Ben, with people who don’t understand, and with our situation. Mom just came in and asked me if it was all right if she got up now and I was a bit short with her because I’m writing and I feel bad about that. I have to do better.

–That I will figure this out, despite my brain which apparently does not work quite in the best way for modern life.

–That Ben will get the job God wants him to be in.

–That the upcoming trip and procedure in DC goes well.

–That Mom will keep what memory she has.

–That Belinda will get that A in biology.

–That Ben will feel better mentally and emotionally and take better care of himself physically.

–That poor Nutmeg will figure out the catbox, or that I will figure out how to get her to it in time.

–That I keep coming up with ideas for stories for the paper, that the paper keeps letting me write them, and that the readers enjoy them. Those little checks that pop up at the middle or end of the month, right when things are about to hit the fan, has saved us more than once. God is good.

–That I take better care of things here. My adhd gets the better of me a lot and I don’t get Mom to wash her face or brush her teeth or take out her partial or any of that stuff. And I don’t remember to tell Sarah to do those things as well. Sarah won’t be able to get braces if she doesn’t step up the oral hygiene. Nobody showers enough. Sheets aren’t changed enough. I don’t cook real meals enough. The house isn’t cleaned enough.

–That I figure out what to do with Mom’s caregivers. We have someone who comes over twice a week, two hours at a time. I’ve made it known I want Mom cleaned up and showered once a week, and that I want her sheets and laundry washed once a week. I also want them to play Scrabble with her. But mostly they just sit in the next room and watch TV with her. I appreciate that I can go and get Sarah without having to find someone who sit with Mom, but it’s not what I asked for and I don’t know how to fix it. I would be happy to do more hours if that’s what’s needed or whatever, but I mean…Ben could sit in there and watch The Lone Ranger in there with her for free.

–For the theater here in Tuttle. I give a lot of my time to the arts council here, making social media art and doing other little things, but the whole organization needs help badly, mostly financially. I was trying to write grants but ran into a hitch. I need to find time to do that again.

–For Lenora and Ben R. They’ve decided to move out and I’m going to miss them terribly, but I want everything to go wonderfully for them!

–For Bennett and Mia. They haven’t been going to church either and I worry about that. I’m praying they are in God’s will and that He blesses their home with abundance and joy.

–For Sarah! I just got a call to set up an appointment for Sarah for food aversion therapy. She’s the pickiest person I’ve ever known, and that is coming from a very picky person. Pray that it goes well and that she can get over this obstacle. She needs lots of prayers.

And finally! Belinda just messaged me this happy news from college. Her biology professor said this morning: “Can anyone but Ms. Garvie tell me what plant cell walls are made of?” That makes my heart so happy! She’s studying so hard for that class and it is paying off. She’ll get that 4.0 yet!

If you made it this far, thank you. I know it was ridiculously rambly and complain-y, but it does feel good to let it out sometimes. I try very hard to keep everything looking like it’s completely fine and I don’t know how to let people know when it is not, while still being socially acceptable. Darn autism again! But it is who I am and I am thankful to be me.

Through all of this, I am still thankful. God is taking amazing care of me and of my family and loved ones. I know this. And one day maybe I’ll look back on this from a much easier spot in life and continue to praise God for everything. And maybe it will be worse then. Who knows. I hope no one gets the idea that I will not be okay through all of this. I will. I just wanted to talk about it.

<3

Hip hip hooray?

I don’t think I have mentioned my own issue on here yet, and I need to do that. Because Belinda was diagnosed with Ehlers-Danlos, I was told that I probably had the same thing. Turns out I do, and I was officially diagnosed on April 17 with my internist, Bernadette Miller. She listened to me talk about the hip problems that I’ve had for probably 20 years. She sent me for an MRI on both hips and I had that on May 13. So on August 4, Belinda and I had appointments, but with the delivery of the bed to Alva and our birthdays and all the other stuff we had to do last week, we ended up requesting a virtual visit.

I now know that I have bilateral labral tears and fraying on both hips, although the right sounded worse when she described it. My chart says it is a Degenerative tear of acetabular labrum of the left hip and of the right hip, although they are not actually degenerative because it happened long ago and has just continued to give me trouble. She said it is a result of the Ehlers-Danlos tissue disorder. That makes sense, as it is a rare disease and no one could figure out what the problem was for so long. Anyway, she has sent an ambulatory referral to Orthopedic Surgery and an ambulatory referral to Physical Therapy. She said the surgeon might decide I need surgery but might also allow me to try PT and alternate therapies first. I have never had a real surgery and I am not thrilled with that idea. But a little while after she told me, I realized that surgery might mean that I would not hurt anymore, which sounds impossible because I’ve hurt for so, so long. But I also wonder if it would just tear again later, since it’s not like I’m going to stop having Ehlers-Danlos. It’s something to think about. I have not received a call from the Orthopedic Surgeon yet to schedule, so I think I’m supposed to call about that. I guess I’ll add that to the tomorrow list, and also appointments with the internist for us in November. And get the banking stuff to Mercy Medical Angels because I keep putting that off!

Having a rare disease is not for wimps!

Here’s a link that I’m going to look at later, when my stomach is ready to prepare for gross pictures of the insides of people.

Hip Problems and Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome

December procedure

Belinda’s next procedure is set for December 17 in DC. I really wanted Belinda to go in September so we could be at the Pediatric Achalasia Awareness Night, but Belinda was adamant that she did not want to miss a single second of her first semester at Northwestern. The couldn’t do fall break or Thanksgiving break, so we set it for Christmas break.

Since Belinda is on Soonercare, she has to get special authorization to travel out of state for her procedure. On paper the procedure is something that can be here in Oklahoma – but we and the doctors believe she needs to have it with the specialists who have been treating her. The other thing is that these specialists are the only pediatric surgeons doing POEM, but she will be 18 in December, and although she’ll still be on Soonercare, I don’t know if they will take the pediatric part into consideration since she’ll be an adult. I wish we could just do the procedure in August before her birthday and get it over with! Anyway, a lady at the hospital will be working with Soonercare and Belinda’s doctor to get it approved. That’s another thing – Belinda will no longer be with the pediatrician that’s treated her since birth by the time the procedure comes around. But she will be with my doctor, and she is wonderful so I believe it will all be fine.

Anyway, even if it doesn’t happen, I still believe God is in control. And maybe Ben will have a job with benefits then and it will all be different anyway. There’s no point in worrying, even if my mind does think about these things.

I do need to focus on what I can work on, like figuring out if we can get assistance again from NORD for lodging and travel in DC. We may have to work on something new since her grant is for pediatric gi rare diseases, and she won’t be pediatric anymore. Hopefully it will just count through the rest of the year. We also need to contact Mercy Medical Angels. Again, since she will be an adult now, they might not be able to help with both of our flights. But we’ll cross that bridge when we get there.

In other news, the durable medical equipment company called we discussed Belinda’s adjustable bed. They asked if they could bring it Thursday, but I reminded them it was for her dorm room. Next week the college will start assigning rooms, and when we know the room, we will see when we can meet in Alva and get the bed set up. They said the mattress wasn’t very comfortable, but I think we’ll just have to see what it is like and then get something different if we need to. Probably we could try to get a better mattress or topper through Soonercare because of the Ehlers-Danlos…but if we can swing it on our own, I’m just going to do it that way. Less stress for Belinda.

Financially we had a bit of a setback because our propane tank had a leak and we lost about 500 dollars worth of propane over the course of two weeks. We didn’t realize until we ran out. Right now we don’t have hot water but it’s not the end of the world. Ben is planning to fix the pipe. But we also owe around 800 to the propane company and it has to be paid before we can get more. So I called the propane company to ask if we could do some sort of payment plan and get a small amount of propane in the meantime, after the pipe is fixed, and they said that would be fine. I was very thankful. We have done business with them for almost 30 years and it is so wonderful when you have that kind of relationship. We got off the phone and I was thinking about that, and then they called back and said they’d discussed it and they were going to pay for half of what was lost – taking about $250 from our bill! I didn’t even know what to say – I was so tongue tied as I was thanking them! What a kindness!

God is with us, every day. I am thankful.

Also, here’s a weird picture Belinda let me take at the Ripley’s Believe it or Not Museum in Gatlinburg, Tennessee, when we were there for her dance nationals two weeks ago. I actually meant to post an album on facebook, I guess I should get on that soon. If you want to see a bit of what Belinda’s other rare disease, Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, looks like…this is part of it. At least she can’t make her eye pop out like the museum pic guy.

Dentist

Belinda went to a new dentist on Monday. Her pediatric dentist left his practice in November, and Belinda had never been to another dentist in her entire life. Since her insurance didn’t have that office in the network, we decided to go to a new dentist entirely. We chose one just over the river in Mustang. They’re all very nice and everything seemed fine…and then they said that she had TWELVE CAVITIES. Well, obviously I was very sus of that information, since Belinda is great about oral hygiene. She always brushes twice and day and flosses once a day. Now, I knew that her pediatric dentist had said she had two shadows that needed to be looked at, but now, four months later, there are TWELVE?? I asked a lot of questions but the dentist seemed positive. He also said that these had been there for at least two years. Um…no.

So on the way home I was talking about second opinions and that’s when Belinda wondered aloud if it could be from the achalasia, like acid going into her mouth. I hadn’t even thought of that. How awful.

I went home and got on the achalasia parents’ facebook group and some people there said their kids had the same issue. I still contacted insurance about a second opinion, just to be sure, and they’re supposed to get back to us early next week about that.

If it is acid, I’m hoping that pepcid that the allergist and internist want her to take will help with that. And I am thankful that we’re finding this out now, before things get worse. We’ll just have to do whatever it takes to protect her teeth.

Another thing to be thankful that it happened before college, and before she’s 18, so I can handle it all without extra difficulty.

Allergy Testing Scheduled!

Finally! After going through hoops for months, Belinda’s allergy testing has been scheduled for March 13 at a clinic in Edmond that specializes in allergies in people with Mast Cell Activation Syndrome. This is one more thing we need to get taken care of so everything is checked off medically before she starts college in Alva in the fall. She’ll also be 18 then, and so she will have to handle more of her medical care as an adult. I will miss having healthcare professionals talk to me without hesitation, since she’s still 17. If we had discovered her issues after August, it would have been so much harder. I thank God that she was diagnosed when she was!

After that, she will go back to the internist in Tulsa on April 17.

It’s hard to believe she will graduate in May. I need to get senior pictures scheduled and start thinking about graduation announcements.

I just realized that her entire high school career has included us dealing with rare disease health care. I pray that her college experience goes smoothly and that the diseases don’t keep her from meeting her goals!

Allergist

I called the allergist again today. They have gotten the referral, and they got the confirmation from insurance they needed today, hooray! Now the doctor will look at everything and see if he believes he will be the best doctor for her. I sure hope so because this has been such a struggle. I’m praying that God’s will be done, though, because I know that even if I’d like to have this doctor work out, if it’s not supposed to be then that’s the way it goes.

Anyway, the lady said they might get back with me today but probably early next week!

EDS ~ POTS ~ MCAS

Today we went to the Ehlers-Danlos specialist in Tulsa. She was WONDERFUL and really listened to us. She agreed with the diagnosis of Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome (EDS), and also added Mast Cell Activation Syndrome (MCAS). She said Belinda also has Postural Orthostatic Tachycardia Syndrome (POTS) but it doesn’t seem to be giving Belinda much trouble at this time. She prescribed an antihistamine, which should help with some reactions Belinda has been having due to the MCAS.

We will go back in four months. In the meantime, she wants Belinda to see an allergist.

It’s a lot, and a ton to learn about. Fortunately, it doesn’t seem to be affecting Belinda too much. I just want to be on top of it for possible future issues.

Here’s a website with some info: The Trifecta: EDS, MCAS, & POTS

Oh, the doctor also said that while the EDS didn’t cause the achalasia, it was very possible that the achalasia was able to develope because she was at a higher risk due to the EDS.

We also went to the Oklahoma Aquarium today, and the Sapulpa Christmas Chute, since we were in the Tulsa area anyway.